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Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
2180
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Posted - 2014.03.11 15:37:00 -
[1] - Quote
I think this would make assaults a much more interesting slayer kind of class.
Shield impairment damage is a vehicle thing currently that makes it so that light weapons really don't stop shield regen on vehicles until there is a high enough alpha damage burst. It makes it so shield delay doesn't kick in until a minimum damaging shot registers.
You could do the same thing with assault suits but with better tuning. Basically make it so that assaults can use their shield to survive the glancing shots from light weapons. Heavier sustained fire that more quickly reduced a shield to 0 would basically be treated the same way and might be reduced by one rep's worth of shield for 50-100 HP. But if shield reaches 0 then impairment damage no longer matters.
Firstly, make rechargers increase shield impairment damage by a small % like 2%/4%/6% while keeping their currently lower recharge bonus.
Then you'd have to come up with a kind of fair balance point using some of the benchmarks out there: light weapon damage.
You should know that unskilled rifle DPS is between 350-450 while skiled DPS with some damage mods can reach 600-800. However, shield impairment is a per shot stat, and most weapons hit for much less than 100 HP per shot. Shields on the other hand start out with 20-30 base repair rate and can get to 100-130 or more with max energizers.
At the low end of light/sidearm weapon damage is the laser rifle that can start it's damage at around 17 HP (20 HP to shields) then you get into the 20's and 30's per shot with the STD unskilled rifles, with max skills and damage mods the highest single uncharged light weapon rifle damage per shot against shield would be the scrambler rifle which could get around or above100 HP depending on skills and which suit its on.
I think the way you'd balance it then is give the suits with the low amount of high slots and low base regen (armor tanks) a higher base shield impairment amount, and then the shield tanks (high shield slot count) a slightly lower base shield impairment amount.
The idea would be that if you skirmish with an assault and you can't break its shield you will lose. I think the balance point for max skilled/ regen fit-armor tanks would be making it so they wouldn't have their shield regen stopped by single shots from ADV scrambler rifles (damage mods/skills not included) (hitting for 90Hp against shield). So once you would include the bonus from 6% per level recharger bonus, you would be looking at a base impairment of 78-79, while max skilled/fit would be 89-90 with a recharge rate of 60-70.
The balance for shield tanks would start a bit lower. Probably the ability to take hits from ADV rail rifles would be reasonable for them. So a base impairment rate of 50-55 would be the starting point for the shield suits because they are able to get reps in excess of 95-120.
IMO this would make the idea of 'speed tanking' a kind of viable thing for assaults. They could run to positions that others couldn't under glancing fire and quickly not have to wait for shield regen delay. Charging head-on would still be a losing proposition, however.
Alternatively, you could give other suits this kind of stat, but make it really only closer to the 20-30 HP amount to absorb the lighter assault weapons/side-arms. |
Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
2183
|
Posted - 2014.03.11 16:42:00 -
[2] - Quote
Spectral Clone wrote:Yes please.
Its like a resistance bonus, but a little bit different from the heavy resistance skill bonus.
Or they could just lower the assault shield recharge delay, and give shield regulator a shield boost effect when it kicks in. Seems easier to implement, but will kind if have the same result, and be a buff in general to shield tanking.
Shield assaults would be regulator monsters and scouts would be recharge beasts.
Yeah, I really don't think it would be THAT big of an added advantage to shield suits at these levels. You COULD increase the armor impairment to even higher levels so that they could, for example, rep through mass driver splash damage and/or glances from unbonused tank blasters.
But since TTK on suits <1000 HP is really only around 2-3 seconds, having the possibility to get 1-2 shield reps off during this time would be significant for head-on 1v1 engagements, and most beneficial for the role that is supposed to be the primary frontline emphasis behind combat. |
Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
2183
|
Posted - 2014.03.11 16:58:00 -
[3] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:This is one of the reasons a shield tank is much better than an armor tank. My dual tanked Sica can negate the damage of a proto madrugar while my rail gun can break it's armor even while hardened. I like the idea but armor should be able to get something similar, maybe over clocked armor repairers when taking damage.
Technically, all armor repairs have always repaired through damage so they already have something similar.
We can't think of shield and armor HP strictly as ONLY buffer. They are really first about weapon damage profiles, and then about HOW OFTEN you can use HOW MUCH of a buffer.
Generally, if you armor tank, you can use a bigger buffer less often.
If you shield tank, you can use a smaller buffer more often.
Over time, you are using the same average amount of buffer-HP per minute of engagement/non-engagement, one just consumes and regenerates faster than the other. To the extent that an armor tank has a dedicated logi they can push this.
If I would alternatively do anything, i would possibly give armor tanks instead an increase to incoming repair amout from hives/tools. |
Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
2183
|
Posted - 2014.03.11 16:59:00 -
[4] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:This is one of the reasons a shield tank is much better than an armor tank. My dual tanked Sica can negate the damage of a proto madrugar while my rail gun can break it's armor even while hardened. I like the idea but armor should be able to get something similar, maybe over clocked armor repairers when taking damage.
Part of the thing here is people don't know how to approach this problem. I think a MLT missile/railgun small turret can stop the shield regen on shield tanks, but they are rarely fitted. Mass drivers will be able to do this also in 1.8. |
Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
2184
|
Posted - 2014.03.11 17:36:00 -
[5] - Quote
The dark cloud wrote:No. If you want to have a suit that has constant regen then use armor. If shields would keep recharging during gunfights then there would be literally no point in using armor ever again. And scouts could become unkillable with their 40HP/s shield regen.
Sorry that this is a wall of text and the details aren't exciting to read, but when you realize that most rifle DPS starts at around 300 and average is closer to 500, being able to rep even 100/s from having mostly rechargers still wouldn't matter ALL that much.
40 HP/S shield regen surely wouldn't make you unkillable. Not to mention my point that a lot of things, (mass drivier, vehicle damage, grenades, charged shots, pistol hits) would likely stop regen on a lot of these things. The bonus would/should only be enough to rep through glancing light weapon fire or damage from weapons outside their optimal range. |
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